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quill stem diameter???

#1 2018-11-27 8:05am

squirrelsmith
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quill stem diameter???

anyone know off the top of their head what the shaft diameter is? .750" or 825"??? something like that


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#2 2018-11-27 8:34am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

I would think anything larger than .75 would be too big to fit, since the 1" steerer tube is the external measurement, wall thickness included.  iirc.


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#3 2018-11-27 8:53am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

I’m thinking 21.1mm

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#4 2018-11-27 9:56am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Yup 21.1 is standard


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#5 2018-11-27 9:59am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

thanks


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#6 2018-11-27 10:04am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

So 0.835” as I recall

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#7 2018-11-27 10:23am

squirrelsmith
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Re: quill stem diameter???

21.1mm = .8307"

either way I just needed to be close for a model i'm making


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#8 2018-11-27 11:35am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

squirrelsmith wrote:

anyone know off the top of their head what the shaft diameter is? .750" or 825"??? something like that

The standard for low-end trash was .833" (21.1mm). The standard for high-end bikes was 22.2mm (7/8"). That was because high end bikes used thinner wall tubing. So, your choices were a low-end fork that was weak because its steel was crap, or a high-end fork that was weak because its steel was thin.

Then BMX happened, and everything was based on Schwinn sizes, including the head tube and steerer of its low-end bikes. And this was a good thing, because BMXers needed the extra strength of the thicker wall tubing. Better tubing plus added thickness just meant that higher-end forks were stronger than standard forks.

Over the past 30 years we've seen a lot of Chinese "BMX" bikes come with the larger stem quill, which is a reversal of the standard: Doing this allows them to use the same tubing for standard bikes (anything but BMX) as for BMX. So where once thinner tubing was typically found on better bikes, its now found on lesser bikes.

Last edited by Crashman (2018-11-27 11:40am)


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#9 2018-11-27 12:20pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Crashman wrote:

squirrelsmith wrote:

anyone know off the top of their head what the shaft diameter is? .750" or 825"??? something like that

The standard for low-end trash was .833" (21.1mm). The standard for high-end bikes was 22.2mm (7/8"). That was because high end bikes used thinner wall tubing. So, your choices were a low-end fork that was weak because its steel was crap, or a high-end fork that was weak because its steel was thin.

Then BMX happened, and everything was based on Schwinn sizes, including the head tube and steerer of its low-end bikes. And this was a good thing, because BMXers needed the extra strength of the thicker wall tubing. Better tubing plus added thickness just meant that higher-end forks were stronger than standard forks.

Over the past 30 years we've seen a lot of Chinese "BMX" bikes come with the larger stem quill, which is a reversal of the standard: Doing this allows them to use the same tubing for standard bikes (anything but BMX) as for BMX. So where once thinner tubing was typically found on better bikes, its now found on lesser bikes.

Define low end trash. Nitto DX was a 21mm quill

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#10 2018-11-27 12:47pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Kurt_Rad wrote:

Crashman wrote:

squirrelsmith wrote:

anyone know off the top of their head what the shaft diameter is? .750" or 825"??? something like that

The standard for low-end trash was .833" (21.1mm). The standard for high-end bikes was 22.2mm (7/8"). That was because high end bikes used thinner wall tubing. So, your choices were a low-end fork that was weak because its steel was crap, or a high-end fork that was weak because its steel was thin.

Then BMX happened, and everything was based on Schwinn sizes, including the head tube and steerer of its low-end bikes. And this was a good thing, because BMXers needed the extra strength of the thicker wall tubing. Better tubing plus added thickness just meant that higher-end forks were stronger than standard forks.

Over the past 30 years we've seen a lot of Chinese "BMX" bikes come with the larger stem quill, which is a reversal of the standard: Doing this allows them to use the same tubing for standard bikes (anything but BMX) as for BMX. So where once thinner tubing was typically found on better bikes, its now found on lesser bikes.

Define low end trash. Nitto DX was a 21mm quill

OMG re-read what I just said then. Make sure you get as far as the second paragraph. Nitto DX was BMX.


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#11 2018-11-27 1:53pm

squirrelsmith
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Re: quill stem diameter???

i'm going .875" a good old fashioned american number

Last edited by squirrelsmith (2018-11-27 1:57pm)


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#12 2018-11-27 2:00pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

squirrelsmith wrote:

thats it im going to mic my dk when i get home lol

It will be around 21.1 or 21.15 because...what I said is 100% true, BMX sizes were based on mass-production Schwinn size (ie, what hardcore bike guys would have called low-end trash).

Edit: There was also 20.8 for Aluminum forks that made it into BMX. And the oddball 22.0 used on most French bikes...I never saw in BMX.

Last edited by Crashman (2018-11-27 2:02pm)


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#13 2018-11-27 2:02pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Crashman wrote:

Kurt_Rad wrote:

Crashman wrote:


The standard for low-end trash was .833" (21.1mm). The standard for high-end bikes was 22.2mm (7/8"). That was because high end bikes used thinner wall tubing. So, your choices were a low-end fork that was weak because its steel was crap, or a high-end fork that was weak because its steel was thin.

Then BMX happened, and everything was based on Schwinn sizes, including the head tube and steerer of its low-end bikes. And this was a good thing, because BMXers needed the extra strength of the thicker wall tubing. Better tubing plus added thickness just meant that higher-end forks were stronger than standard forks.

Over the past 30 years we've seen a lot of Chinese "BMX" bikes come with the larger stem quill, which is a reversal of the standard: Doing this allows them to use the same tubing for standard bikes (anything but BMX) as for BMX. So where once thinner tubing was typically found on better bikes, its now found on lesser bikes.

Define low end trash. Nitto DX was a 21mm quill

OMG re-read what I just said then. Make sure you get as far as the second paragraph. Nitto DX was BMX.

Meh. Don’t have time for that

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#14 2018-11-27 8:22pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Kurt_Rad wrote:

Crashman wrote:

Kurt_Rad wrote:


Define low end trash. Nitto DX was a 21mm quill

OMG re-read what I just said then. Make sure you get as far as the second paragraph. Nitto DX was BMX.

Meh. Don’t have time for that

Short version: Before BMX, low-carbon steel forks used 21.1 quills, high-end forks used 22.2. BMX adopted the LOWER standard because it was based on Schwinn's mass-production bikes.


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#15 2018-11-27 9:05pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Crashman wrote:

Kurt_Rad wrote:

Crashman wrote:


OMG re-read what I just said then. Make sure you get as far as the second paragraph. Nitto DX was BMX.

Meh. Don’t have time for that

Short version: Before BMX, low-carbon steel forks used 21.1 quills, high-end forks used 22.2. BMX adopted the LOWER standard because it was based on Schwinn's mass-production bikes.

cool that I have time for

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#16 2018-11-28 6:35pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Just for the record I measured a dk and a Hutch deep H.  Both were ~21.0.  I guess the hole is 21.1.


Hutch Fun Facts: All main line Hutch's with digits only S/N (no letters or baseballs) on the rear drop outs were US made and had their dropouts stamped between late '83 and '86.  Obviously the frame manufacture would occur slightly after that, even if they just threw 'em in a bucket randomly.  There is an obvious date code in that the first 2 digits seem to be the month and the 3rd digit is pretty obviously the last digit of the year running from '83-'86.

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#17 2018-11-28 9:07pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

troynlori wrote:

Just for the record I measured a dk and a Hutch deep H.  Both were ~21.0.  I guess the hole is 21.1.

There is way more slop than that


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#18 2019-01-02 2:10pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

.815" or 20.7mm is what my Dk is on a digital micrometer


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#19 2019-01-02 5:16pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

I can't help it if your dk is smaller than mine.


Hutch Fun Facts: All main line Hutch's with digits only S/N (no letters or baseballs) on the rear drop outs were US made and had their dropouts stamped between late '83 and '86.  Obviously the frame manufacture would occur slightly after that, even if they just threw 'em in a bucket randomly.  There is an obvious date code in that the first 2 digits seem to be the month and the 3rd digit is pretty obviously the last digit of the year running from '83-'86.

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#20 2019-01-02 9:43pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

My dk has been more acurately measured than yours lol


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#21 2019-01-03 9:45am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

squirrelsmith wrote:

.815" or 20.7mm is what my Dk is on a digital micrometer

Your DK is mini. There were aluminum forks with aluminum steerers that required thicker tubing, hence the smaller quill.


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#22 2019-01-03 9:48am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

squirrelsmith wrote:

troynlori wrote:

Just for the record I measured a dk and a Hutch deep H.  Both were ~21.0.  I guess the hole is 21.1.

There is way more slop than that

I'm an engineer, not a machinist. Therefore 20.3 = ~21.0


Hutch Fun Facts: All main line Hutch's with digits only S/N (no letters or baseballs) on the rear drop outs were US made and had their dropouts stamped between late '83 and '86.  Obviously the frame manufacture would occur slightly after that, even if they just threw 'em in a bucket randomly.  There is an obvious date code in that the first 2 digits seem to be the month and the 3rd digit is pretty obviously the last digit of the year running from '83-'86.

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#23 2019-01-03 10:18am

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Re: quill stem diameter???

Crashman wrote:

squirrelsmith wrote:

.815" or 20.7mm is what my Dk is on a digital micrometer

Your DK is mini. There were aluminum forks with aluminum steerers that required thicker tubing, hence the smaller quill.

No


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#24 2019-01-03 12:29pm

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Re: quill stem diameter???

squirrelsmith wrote:

Crashman wrote:

squirrelsmith wrote:

.815" or 20.7mm is what my Dk is on a digital micrometer

Your DK is mini. There were aluminum forks with aluminum steerers that required thicker tubing, hence the smaller quill.

No

OK...https://bmxmuseum.com/reference/3408
https://bmxmuseum.com/reference-images/mity_2_blowup.jpg
Maybe that's not what the undersized stems were for...but I had a UFO stem that was likewise 20.7mm, and it is an odd size.

Heck, the proper sizes were .833 for BMX, Huffy, etc, and .875 for higher-end non-BMX bikes, so 21.1 is rounded down from 21.158mm. Then again, you couldn't round UP to 21.2mm when machining the things and be assured they'd fit...

Last edited by Crashman (2019-01-03 12:38pm)


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#25 2019-01-03 1:15pm

squirrelsmith
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Re: quill stem diameter???

My stem is a pro xxl and its .815" these are facts


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