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POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE  RSS Feed

#26 2011-06-17 12:33am

Dirty Habits
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

yikes S______________I_______________C_____________________K___________________!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cool


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#27 2011-06-17 12:48am

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

I'm also waiting on the actuator.......I'm sure you all have seen this already, old pic actually, brakes and bridge are show polished now by the Master OG RL20II....

http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o135/diabloDM/2011-03-04021149-1.jpg


By the way Matt your cable is rubbing your tire...it's supposed to be tucked in that hole in the center of the flat plate of the actuator.

smile


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#28 2011-06-17 7:41pm

HUTCH-HUNTER
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

The Master....LOL    My cable isn't rubbing!!!!! It is suppose to be axactly how I have it..... thanks for the concern  though!!!!      wink

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#29 2011-06-18 8:51pm

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

No problem Bro.......man the more I look at the pics of your bikes the more I regret having to give mine up......oh well....new bike is gonna be R A D......

smile


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#30 2011-06-18 9:44pm

Red43j
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

I always felt this brake was ahead of its time, and I wished it had gotten a fair chance back in the day to be scrutinized, only to see if it was all that. Loved how it looked, and how the sleeve was used. Had a very clean look, and man, I'd love to have seen more bikes running a similar setup.


“There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” -Will Rogers

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#31 2011-06-18 9:53pm

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Oh I agree......aweeome setup, although the original design actuator was not a good design the new setups like the one on Matt's, Ernie's, Marc's, and my bike involve the use of a linear sleeve with bearings inside which is far superior to the old setup....if they had used this linear setup back then it may have been a success.

Last edited by diablo (2011-06-18 9:56pm)


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#32 2011-07-07 2:10pm

ZOO BOO
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

I got the same fork set-up

http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g326/Witeface/HF4.jpg


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#33 2011-07-07 6:21pm

vt102
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

ZOO BOO wrote:

I got the same fork set-up

http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g32 … ce/HF4.jpg

Nice......who did your setup???

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#34 2011-07-07 7:19pm

hutchgirl
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

You guys are VERY talanted. Cool to see. Thanks for posting. cool


*** H U T C H ***

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#35 2011-07-07 10:19pm

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

ZOO BOO wrote:

I got the same fork set-up

http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g32 … ce/HF4.jpg

Looks like Randy's old setup (looptail nut)? I'd know that bridge anywhere....lol

smile


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#36 2011-07-08 3:06am

Hrkhotrods
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

I picked up a set of the Suntour rc brakes for this conversion. Rather than experimenting with a bunch of stuff that doesn't work, does anyone have a part number or can you tell me your source for the linear bearing? Did you machine your own "HUTCH" bridge and if so care to share your specs or cad file?


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#37 2011-07-08 5:49am

01blacks4
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Hrkhotrods wrote:

I picked up a set of the Suntour rc brakes for this conversion. Rather than experimenting with a bunch of stuff that doesn't work, does anyone have a part number or can you tell me your source for the linear bearing? Did you machine your own "HUTCH" bridge and if so care to share your specs or cad file?

the bridge is machined by O.G. RL ....hit him up.
the bearing is sourced from macmaster-carr.  its just a 7/8 linier bearing.  they are like 10 bucks i think.  you will need to hone the fork for it to slip in....i have done 2 and they both were ditterent as to how much was honed.  but its not much, a 32 maybe.  thats its, easy to do.

marc

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#38 2011-07-08 6:37am

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

AND, if you choose not to hone your fork out (like me and vt102) you will need a 21mm outer diameter linear bearing....those generally come with 12mm shaft holes but I managed to find one by SKF known as the LBBR 14 which has a 14mm shaft hole, that's plenty strong. Grease the outside of the linear bearing and tap them right into the fork, very easy.

And you DEFINITELY will need O.g. RL 20II's help to do this setup...as you can see he has Mastered this craft.....

Let us know how it goes!

smile

Last edited by diablo (2011-07-09 12:26am)


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#39 2011-07-08 8:02pm

01blacks4
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

diablo wrote:

AND, if you choose not to hone your fork out (like me and vt102) you will need a 21mm outer diameter linear bearing....those generally come with 12mm shaft holes but I managed to find one by SBK known as the LBBR 14 which has a 14mm shaft hole, that's plenty strong. Grease the outside of the linear bearing and tap them right into the fork, very easy.

And you DEFINITELY will need O.g. RL 20II's help to do this setup...as you can see he has Mastered this craft.....

Let us know how it goes!

smile

no offense to ANYONE, but you dont need his help...its pretty basic and straight forward.  FWIW O.G. rl20II  honed his fork also...are you sure your forks are not honed?

the main reason you hone them is because the pipe is not perfectly round on the inside...no pipe really is.  if you measure your fork, it will be ABOUT 21 mm...

if the bearing is to tight the shaft will not slide like butter, it will still move but it should "fall out" of the bearing when held verticail.

Last edited by 01blacks4 (2011-07-08 8:04pm)

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#40 2011-07-09 12:25am

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

01blacks4 wrote:

diablo wrote:

AND, if you choose not to hone your fork out (like me and vt102) you will need a 21mm outer diameter linear bearing....those generally come with 12mm shaft holes but I managed to find one by SBK known as the LBBR 14 which has a 14mm shaft hole, that's plenty strong. Grease the outside of the linear bearing and tap them right into the fork, very easy.

And you DEFINITELY will need O.g. RL 20II's help to do this setup...as you can see he has Mastered this craft.....

Let us know how it goes!

smile

no offense to ANYONE, but you dont need his help...its pretty basic and straight forward.  FWIW O.G. rl20II  honed his fork also...are you sure your forks are not honed?

the main reason you hone them is because the pipe is not perfectly round on the inside...no pipe really is.  if you measure your fork, it will be ABOUT 21 mm...

if the bearing is to tight the shaft will not slide like butter, it will still move but it should "fall out" of the bearing when held verticail.

Well...

I have yet to see anyone create an actuator as well done as Ernie's....and no offense to you either but in the video you posted of your working setup it looks like your rollercam plate is 'bolted' on to the actuator causing the plate to twist side to side while it moves up and down whereas the actuator is supposed to be one solid piece.

And yes I'm positive my fork is not honed, I'm the one who put the bearing in myself...as a matter of fact I put two bearings in there for more stability and the shaft rides smoothly with no issues. The reason I did not bore my fork is cause I broke two of these forks back in the day and at 200lbs now I'm not taking any chances, we all know Hutch stuff ain't the strongest and we all know very well how hard it is to find a set of these forks nowadays.

Again, not attacking you or anyone here, just that Ernie's been getting fed up with people thinking this is just some simple bolt on affair that you can do with simple hand tools, it is NOT....if people want it done right have him do it or have him teach you how to do it.

Marc, your buildup post with the Suntour setup was the most inspirational thread I have ever seen and has caused a lot of interest in these brake systems, I applaud you for that....hope you understand whre I'm coming from.

Last edited by diablo (2011-07-09 12:30am)


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#41 2011-07-09 6:51am

OSmojo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

OK I messed up, I found bargain NOS Suntour roller cams, perfect for a project I have for two 26 cruiser bmx's for myself and my wife. So I bought 2 pairs for just over $100. So I call on the wisdom of my learned friends, prey answer my problem (I prey to the Lord all my problems be so small)

http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/doh.gif3.gif#1. I wanted to put full fenders on the bikes which I guess isn't possible with roller cams?
http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/doh.gif3.gif#2. The Pivots for Roller Cams are brazed way high up on those old frames and forks that were made for roller cams, on my Cruiser frame and forks they are brazed in a more modern location namely lower, so if the roller cams were put on, the pads would hit 10 inches below the rim. Is there any type of adaptor for the roller Cams that exists that places the roller cams higher in the correct position?
http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/doh.gif3.gif#3. The pivot holes in the Cams might be larger than the standard pivots, is there an adapter for that? (if the answers to questions 1 & 2 are negative this question will be redundant anyway)

Suntour XC Sport Roller Cams
http://www.bikestash.com/images/BS_Suntour-XC-Sport-Roller-Cam-Brake-Set.jpg


"If everything feels under control, you're not going fast enough" - Mario Andretti

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#42 2011-07-09 6:59am

Coco
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From: Regina, Saskatchewan Canada
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

OSmojo wrote:

OK I messed up, I found bargain NOS Suntour roller cams, perfect for a project I have for two 26 cruiser bmx's for myself and my wife. So I bought 2 pairs for just over $100. So I call on the wisdom of my learned friends, prey answer my problem (I prey to the Lord all my problems be so small)

http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/f … h.gif3.gif#1. I wanted to put full fenders on the bikes which I guess isn't possible with roller cams?
http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/f … h.gif3.gif#2. The Pivots for Roller Cams are brazed way high up on those old frames and forks that were made for roller cams, on my Cruiser frame and forks they are brazed in a more modern location namely lower, so if the roller cams were put on, the pads would hit 10 inches below the rim. Is there any type of adaptor for the roller Cams that exists that places the roller cams higher in the correct position?
http://www.the-streaming-lounge.co.uk/f … h.gif3.gif#3. The pivot holes in the Cams might be larger than the standard pivots, is there an adapter for that? (if the answers to questions 1 & 2 are negative this question will be redundant anyway)

Suntour XC Sport Roller Cams
http://www.bikestash.com/images/BS_Sunt … ke-Set.jpg

If I recall correctly, the roller cams use the same brake post mount location as a 990. There are adapters so you can put a 990 on a regular (non-v brake) brake location. The adapter plate bolts to the brake bridge like an old Dia Compe caliper. Only thing is you will have to remove the brake post studs if possible and the roller cam brakes may also interfere with the weld-on brake post stud mounts that are welded onto the seat stays. I'm sure someone with more experience with doing what you are trying to accomplish will chime in.

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#43 2011-07-09 7:08am

OSmojo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Coco, thanks, I've done some initial googling, looks promising. I doubt I can ever put the fenders on though.


"If everything feels under control, you're not going fast enough" - Mario Andretti

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#44 2011-07-09 7:23am

Coco
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From: Regina, Saskatchewan Canada
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

OSmojo wrote:

Coco, thanks, I've done some initial googling, looks promising. I doubt I can ever put the fenders on though.

They may not look very nice but some removable ATB fenders like THE ect have a very thin waist area and may fit. I'm thinking anything designed to fit with v-brakes may work since both are tall and the fender would have to clear the roller cam area and the cable on the v-brakes but you've probably tried those already. Just bunny hop over the puddles. big_smile I do see you live in England so I can understand the need for fenders on a daily rider.

I'll stop hijacking this thread now.

Last edited by Coco (2011-07-09 7:25am)

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#45 2011-07-09 7:43am

Hrkhotrods
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Thanks for the heads up guys wink Ille pm him later tonight, driving to the beach now smile


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#46 2011-07-10 1:51pm

01blacks4
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

diablo...  it is bolted...

the video you see is  very early before the springs are dialed in with even tension.  this issue would be hidden if
it was hard mounted.  if it was mounted on a cable, it would be shown exactly like it was in the video...  it doesnt move like this anylonger... the springs are now of equal tension.

the issue is the original suntour design is meant to float, as it did when it was attached to a cable...

when you make it a solid mount like woody and ernie did it cannot float as it needs and will bind in the rollers.

when mounted to a cable you have movement up and down and front to back.  when mounted as yours is it will ride on the edge of the cams... not that it will not work, it just will not work as it was orginally designed. (by suntour, not woody)

this is why i did it the way i did, i wanted something as close to the original design of suntour.

FWIW...i did mine in the garage with hand tools....i needed forks and picked them up from ernie with the mounts welded on.  but thats cause he ad the forks, not cause i cant weld smile

tell ernie hi, sorry he thinks he is the only guy that can do this "the right way" big_smilecool

they are all cool, i think you took my comments the wrong way....

thanks for the kind words though...much apprciated

Last edited by 01blacks4 (2011-07-10 1:58pm)

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#47 2011-07-10 1:54pm

diablo
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

01blacks4 wrote:

diablo...  it is bolted...

the video you see is  very early before the springs are dialed in with even tension.  this issue would be hidden if
it was hard mounted.  if it was mounted on a cable, it would be shown exactly like it was in the video...  it doesnt move like this anylonger... the springs are now of equal tension.

the issue is the original suntour design is meant to float, as it did when it was attached to a cable...

when you make it a solid mount like woody and ernie did it cannot float as it needs and will bind in the rollers.

when mounted to a cable you have movement up and down and front to back.  when mounted as yours is it will ride on the edge of the cams... not that it will not work, it just will not work as it was orginally designed. (by suntour, not woody)

this is why i did it the way i did, i wanted something as close to the original design of suntour.

they are all cool, i think you took my comments the wrong way....

thanks for the kind words though...much apprciated

Aaah, got it....pure Genius Bro, well, you were always one step ahead.

smile


To be old and wise you must first be young and stupid......

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#48 2011-09-22 12:19am

vt102
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Finally got mine finished! Thanks Ernie. Check it out here:
http://bmxmuseum.com/forums/viewtopic.p … 64&p=2

Last edited by vt102 (2011-09-22 12:20am)

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#49 2011-09-22 6:35am

freestyl
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From: Keller, TX
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Posts: 161

Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Matt my friend, you have the bug more now then when we were kids I think.  You know, Matt and I use to ride together when we were younger.  He is also the only person I know of, other than a Hutch factory rider, or a magazine, who had one of my real forks back in the 80's.  This I know because he got it from me.  I only wish we could figure out where that fork went.  In any case, your bikes look really nice Matt.  To bad I moved before I had a chance to come over and ride it.   Woody

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#50 2011-09-22 7:40am

vt102
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Re: POST UP YOUR ROLLER CAM BRAKE PROJECTS - WOODY / HUTCH STYLE

Thanks for the piece of history Woody. I remember seeing pics of your TS with those brakes, and was in awe. I would never thought in a million years I would have a set-up similar to yours. Thank you to all the members here who made it happen. smile

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