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troynlori · RSS feed for topic

Need some advice. I picked up this bike with 1st gen Bullseye cranks:

If you know these cranks, you know they have a 22mm hollow axle spindle and the right arm is welded to the spindle. I cant figure out what the heck happened, but the left are and right arm are not lined up. At first, I thought the left are was just on the wrong spline. But when I went to move it...nope....something's wrong. Best I can tell, the spindle is either twisted, or someone was drunk when they welded the arm on. I didn't count the splines, but I assume it is 48 spline, which means the most it can be off is 3.5 degrees. I would say these are off by about 3 degrees.

Today I took it to a trusted metal worker who heated the spindle (within reason) and hit the arm with a special hammer (lots of impact without damage to the part). No joy. This spindle is strong as heck...can't believe it is twisted!

I am considering sending it to sum one like the frame doc, having him cut the arm off the spindle and reweld it to the proper position. (I know, there's always the chance it will bend back, but I'm willing to take that risk). My questions:

1) Does anyone know a better way?

2) In your opinion, what does this do to the value (not asking for selling purposes). Am I better off to leave it alone vs. cut it? I don't think I'll let my son ride it like this much...don't need no knee/hip damage. This crank goes with this cruiser so well....

Okay. I'm done typing.

Oceans Deep · 2012-09-04 5:55pm

In my opinion it looks like it's just on the wrong spline. But I'm sure you've tried all that. Try it again?

troynlori · 2012-09-04 6:00pm

Yep...that's what I thought. Take it off...move it left and oops...one spline too many that way. Move it the other, oops... Finally it sets in....you're SOL!

maximum85 · 2012-09-04 6:09pm

bummer..that would drive me nuts..i have a redline flight spindle like that on a show bike..you can't tell by looking at it,but i know..i'd leave it..

kegger · 2012-09-04 6:12pm

i had some profile crank arms that had the same thing
1/2 a spline away from 180 degrees
i even tried different spindles and came up with the same thing
i solved it by selling them, full discloser, of course

Fatboy · 2012-09-04 6:16pm

Un - NO - you don't ever cut your spindle and reweld. That's like cutting a few inches out of your seatbelt and just sewing the ends together at a more comfortable length.... It won't hold when you need it to.

First check the alignment - one spline over and is it too much in the OTHER direction? then you are SOL - just live with it. It's not that bad.

I had this with a profile spindle once... just that one didn't align. Had to have it replaced.

BirdDog · 2012-09-04 6:21pm

Yeap, these cranks were known for twisting BITD (They were also the lightest cromo 3 piece cranks BITD). This may sound crazy, but have you tried rotating the cranks in the opposing direction of the bend and "hopping" with all your weight to bend them back to or close to the original configuration? It worked BITD... just saying.

troynlori · 2012-09-04 6:32pm

Maximum - I hear you, but this is no show bike. We don't have show bikes. I struggle to let my kid ride it with it uneven. I struggle to sit there and look at it. It belongs on this bike (the whole bike was made with lightest components and it is ridiculous. It needs these cranks:

http://bmxmuseum.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=430204

Fatboy - just to make sure I'm clear....I don't mean cut the spindle. I mean cut the weld, clean it and reweld it in the right position. It was welded there in the first place, though I get your concern. "Replacing" means chucking a crank that frequently sells for up to $500.

BirdDog - I like this advice. I'm going to try it. I have my doubt though. I put it in a vice and put a 2 foot cheater bar on it. It just twisted the vice in the mount. I'm willing to go neanderthal on it. By the way, I bet these are the lightest cromo chranks even by today's standards. It suddenly occurs to me that the new Redline Flight 2.5 cranks are a direct copy....(of the concept at least).

Thanks for the input guys, all of it is appreciated.

danb · 2012-09-04 6:40pm

troynlori wrote:
Need some advice. I picked up this bike with 1st gen Bullseye cranks:

http://i967.photobucket.com/albums/ae15 … CI0390.jpg

If you know these cranks, you know they have a 22mm hollow axle spindle and the right arm is welded to the spindle. I cant figure out what the heck happened, but the left are and right arm are not lined up. At first, I thought the left are was just on the wrong spline. But when I went to move it...nope....something's wrong. Best I can tell, the spindle is either twisted, or someone was drunk when they welded the arm on. I didn't count the splines, but I assume it is 48 spline, which means the most it can be off is 3.5 degrees. I would say these are off by about 3 degrees.

Today I took it to a trusted metal worker who heated the spindle (within reason) and hit the arm with a special hammer (lots of impact without damage to the part). No joy. This spindle is strong as heck...can't believe it is twisted!

I am considering sending it to sum one like the frame doc, having him cut the arm off the spindle and reweld it to the proper position. (I know, there's always the chance it will bend back, but I'm willing to take that risk). My questions:

1) Does anyone know a better way?

2) In your opinion, what does this do to the value (not asking for selling purposes). Am I better off to leave it alone vs. cut it? I don't think I'll let my son ride it like this much...don't need no knee/hip damage. This crank goes with this cruiser so well....

Okay. I'm done typing.

you would have to have the crank fixture to get it strait.. I know that it was done from the factory i have a few sets like this. the fixture was made wrong hence the reason they redid the jig.. honest mistake and most people would never feel it

troynlori · 2012-09-04 6:45pm

danb - do I understand right....you are suggesting these were made this way from Bullseye, and you have ones made in a similar way and that Bullseye had to redo their fixture?

I'm going out on a limb and saying, I believe that. I have looked these cranks over and over, and I struggle to believe the spindle is twisted.

I know you'd have to have a fixture, but also, if I understand you right, someone would have to have "THE" fixture?

Ughh....coolest cranks I've ever owned.

Anyhow Dan...how 'ya like that ELF?

danb · 2012-09-04 6:56pm

Lol I love my Elf or should i say ELFs I know about crank fixtures because i made the same mistake on my first run that i had to trash. check this out take the cranks off
lay the spindle and crank on the table flat.
insert the other arm 180* off that way both pedal bosses are on the same side and see if they line up.

making fixtures is not hard, I would say that it was trial and error on their part and this was one of the sets that got out before they noticed the mistake

troynlori · 2012-09-05 9:45am

Already tried that one (installing 180 off). It's the same error either 12 O'clock or 6 O'clock.

I'm leaning more towards believing that the spindle is not twisted, but rather the left arm and the right arm/spindle were made separate and never checked together at the factory. I'm going to have someone with a left arm install their arm on my spindle and see if it is my right side or my left side that is off.

Thanks for all the input.

Dan...I'll try to get this minicruiser to represent your brand well. As well as the '94 20" XL I'm working on too. Never owned ELF's before, but I like 'em.

oldmetal · 2012-09-15 6:20pm

troynlori wrote:
I'm leaning more towards believing that the spindle is not twisted, but rather the left arm and the right arm/spindle were made separate and never checked together at the factory.

That was my thought, or possibly one arm came from a different set.
With my Hurricane cranks (3-piece, but similar to 2-piece 2nd/3rd Gen) I noticed that depending on which way you orientate the spindle (crank arms are both seperate) the arms either line up exactly or are slightly out. I think they were handmade 1 set at a time, so each will be different.

troynlori · 2012-09-15 6:56pm

We did confirm that the spindle was not twisted. The left arm was made wrong. Fortunately, and to my complete surprise, I found someone with a proper left arm so all is lined up now. Will be coming back from powder coater soon.

On to next question...."BULLSEYE" sticker....goes on face or top of crank arm?

oldmetal · 2012-09-20 1:38pm

troynlori wrote:
"BULLSEYE" sticker....goes on face or top of crank arm?

I don't know from personal experience, but an old Gen 1 Bullseye ad (scroll down to my post) shows the stickers on the tops of the arms (foil-type like Ray's cranks?). Gen 2 and 3 had the clear stickers on the crank face: http://bmxmuseum.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=18524

troynlori · 2012-09-20 3:13pm

Yeah...I noticed that. I'm wondering if that was always the case on first gen. Anyhow, I like the way they look on the face, but I also like being "authentic" so I'll have to make a little decision, but I think I'll put 'em on the tops instead of the face. On the otherhand, mine are not foil type, they are clear (what I bought from colored tuffs).

oldmetal · 2012-09-20 3:29pm

I can't say if that was always the case. I see some folks have the foil stickers on 2nd/3rd Gen cranks, whether they did that or Bullseye did that I don't know.
The foil ones appear on Ebay now & then, though maybe the price is hiked in many cases. You could try contacting Bullseye and see if they have any left (they have an Ebay account, and had decent prices when I got my clear stickers).

troynlori · 2012-09-20 3:50pm

Then there is this ad:

http://bmxmuseum.com/forums/viewtopic.p … 3#p2200853

Where there is no sticker. I'm not convinced that Bullseye had a policy of their own on the matter.

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Twisted Bullseye crank spindle

Twisted Bullseye crank spindle

#2 2012-09-04 5:55pm

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#3 2012-09-04 6:00pm

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#4 2012-09-04 6:09pm

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#5 2012-09-04 6:12pm

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#6 2012-09-04 6:16pm

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#7 2012-09-04 6:21pm

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#8 2012-09-04 6:32pm

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#9 2012-09-04 6:40pm

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troynlori wrote:

#10 2012-09-04 6:45pm

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#11 2012-09-04 6:56pm

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#12 2012-09-05 9:45am

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#13 2012-09-15 6:20pm

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troynlori wrote:

#14 2012-09-15 6:56pm

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#15 2012-09-20 1:38pm

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troynlori wrote:

#16 2012-09-20 3:13pm

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#17 2012-09-20 3:29pm

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#18 2012-09-20 3:50pm

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