What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?  RSS Feed

#1 2012-11-07 2:06pm

jasonmiami
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What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Can someone help me understand why the new race bikes I see photos of look so stupid? The bars seem narrow, the seat is really low and always pointed upwards so that it hits you right in the balls... This doesn't seem to make sense to me...

I started racing in 1978 and find it hard to believe that any of the current riders of today could be faster than the heroes of my youth in the early 80s. I know that I was fastest in 1984 and the last time I raced in about 2000, the guys at the track did not have a chance.

Am I missing something? Have tracks changed? Have they made the jumps in such a way that the old school bikes simply don't work anymore?

I'd really like to get back on the track, just for some fun, but I don't understand the new set up...

Thoughts?

Jason

Last edited by jasonmiami (2012-11-07 3:05pm)

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#2 2012-11-07 2:32pm

mongoosefreak
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Almost every freestyle or race bike I see around here have the slammed seat. The seat post is only about a inch and a half if that long. They are pivotal post with a pivotal seat. It has a lot to do with weight. People want there bikes as light as they can get them. Also a lot of people who ride now rarely use their seats. So a long seat post is just in the way, and unessasary weight added to the bike. I also like the look of the slammed seat and have owned several bikes with one..cool

Last edited by mongoosefreak (2012-11-07 2:34pm)

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#3 2012-11-07 3:09pm

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Thanks for the reply...However, in my racing days, I remember using the seat for balance or driving the bike to one side or the other on a jump. If the seat is out of the way, I would think I would lose the ability to control the bike?

The wide sloping turn, the seat, helps limit how far you lean the bike over. I find the seat and seat post to me extension of the frame, making it quite useful residence something in the way. Variously backseat posts give you some more room in the cockpit, but slamming it down might make it hit my feet.

Maybe I'm just not getting it and am too old:D

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#4 2012-11-07 3:25pm

jkraig
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

jasonmiami wrote:

Thanks for the reply...However, in my racing days, I remember using the seat for balance or driving the bike to one side or the other on a jump. If the seat is out of the way, I would think I would lose the ability to control the bike?

The wide sloping turn, the seat, helps limit how far you lean the bike over. I find the seat and seat post to me extension of the frame, making it quite useful residence something in the way. Variously backseat posts give you some more room in the cockpit, but slamming it down might make it hit my feet.

Maybe I'm just not getting it and am too old:D

I agree. I do not understand the new set up either. Maybe for a jumping/freestyle bike, but NOT a racer.


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#5 2012-11-07 4:13pm

jasvanek
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Well, I know why I keep my seat all the way down. I do it so that when going over jumps/rollers it doesn't hit me in the butt. Lesson learned the hard way. As far as tilted at the high angle, I have no idea. I think that's kind of like the parachute pants of the 90s, no reason. Best guess is just because pivotal seats will let you do that. I've heard that taking a hard knock breaks the seat off which can't be fun. Kids, what are you going to do?


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#6 2012-11-07 4:26pm

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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

they stand the whole race, no need for the long posts.

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#7 2012-11-07 4:35pm

AApro
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

the seat is only used for controling the bike with ur legs while racing

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#8 2012-11-07 4:51pm

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Strange, I don't recall my seat hitting me in the rear or nuts that often but I would want to take it off the bike or lower it. And I raced quite often back in the day...

But I do remember is that I would be off the seat for the entire straightaway, then depending on the size of the turn and the angle of the berm, I might go down the seat for a moment as I exit the apex. Normally, I would probably be up on the petals peddling for 95% of the race.

It does make for strange analogy comparison... I now race motorcycles, hare scrambles and enduros, and while I could stay up on the foot pegs, is far more comfortable and I get more traction when I'm sitting and getting on the gas. Standing up on the pegs make sense over what's and jumping obstacles, but sitting makes more sense entering turns and getting on the gas.

It just looks silly to me to have a seat on a bike and had a jammed all the way low and pointed up. Does it have something to do with the way they pump the bike instead of pedal and the fact that the jumps all seem to have a consistent slope and are nice and smooth?

The jumps back in the day would vary from a very steep tabletop, to a shallow one, to a water crossing, to doubles, triples, or quads, often more.

To me, the tracks today seem rather silly, too well groomed, and they don't offer as much benefit being on the inside versus the outside which is the luck of the draw.

I like my seat... I think I'll keep it up high where I can use it in the comfortable;-)

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#9 2012-11-07 5:35pm

AApro
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

jasonmiami wrote:

Strange, I don't recall my seat hitting me in the rear or nuts that often but I would want to take it off the bike or lower it. And I raced quite often back in the day...

But I do remember is that I would be off the seat for the entire straightaway, then depending on the size of the turn and the angle of the berm, I might go down the seat for a moment as I exit the apex. Normally, I would probably be up on the petals peddling for 95% of the race.

It does make for strange analogy comparison... I now race motorcycles, hare scrambles and enduros, and while I could stay up on the foot pegs, is far more comfortable and I get more traction when I'm sitting and getting on the gas. Standing up on the pegs make sense over what's and jumping obstacles, but sitting makes more sense entering turns and getting on the gas.

It just looks silly to me to have a seat on a bike and had a jammed all the way low and pointed up. Does it have something to do with the way they pump the bike instead of pedal and the fact that the jumps all seem to have a consistent slope and are nice and smooth?

The jumps back in the day would vary from a very steep tabletop, to a shallow one, to a water crossing, to doubles, triples, or quads, often more.

To me, the tracks today seem rather silly, too well groomed, and they don't offer as much benefit being on the inside versus the outside which is the luck of the draw.

I like my seat... I think I'll keep it up high where I can use it in the comfortable;-)

yep

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#10 2012-11-08 6:30am

jasvanek
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

jasonmiami wrote:

Strange, I don't recall my seat hitting me in the rear or nuts that often but I would want to take it off the bike or lower it. And I raced quite often back in the day...

But I do remember is that I would be off the seat for the entire straightaway, then depending on the size of the turn and the angle of the berm, I might go down the seat for a moment as I exit the apex. Normally, I would probably be up on the petals peddling for 95% of the race.

It does make for strange analogy comparison... I now race motorcycles, hare scrambles and enduros, and while I could stay up on the foot pegs, is far more comfortable and I get more traction when I'm sitting and getting on the gas. Standing up on the pegs make sense over what's and jumping obstacles, but sitting makes more sense entering turns and getting on the gas.

It just looks silly to me to have a seat on a bike and had a jammed all the way low and pointed up. Does it have something to do with the way they pump the bike instead of pedal and the fact that the jumps all seem to have a consistent slope and are nice and smooth?

The jumps back in the day would vary from a very steep tabletop, to a shallow one, to a water crossing, to doubles, triples, or quads, often more.

To me, the tracks today seem rather silly, too well groomed, and they don't offer as much benefit being on the inside versus the outside which is the luck of the draw.

I like my seat... I think I'll keep it up high where I can use it in the comfortable;-)

Problem solved!

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t471/jasvanek/echo_trial_proto.jpg

Honestly, if you don't like the look, then don't drop your seat. Don't let your pants sag, don't put 24" wheels on your Caprice or whatever. If having your seat all the way up works for you, great! For me it doesn't but there's no reason to down what works best for someone else.


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#11 2012-11-08 7:53am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Maybe we should move on to talking about the strange sprockets?

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#12 2012-11-08 7:57am

KuWa FS
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Nobody sits down to race!


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#13 2012-11-08 8:19am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Maybe not any more, but I dont call concrete turns and nice smooth jumps racing anyway! I call that being a primadona on a bike!

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#14 2012-11-08 8:33am

GhettoBMXstar
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From: Lexington, KY
Registered: 2012-01-24
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

The reason for the sloped seats on race bikes is due to the 15 degree slope on most starting hills. In staging, while getting clipped in or using flats, having the seat angled adds some relief when waiting on the starter's call. Now with seatpost being so low, I wouldn't ride a race bike from eighties on today's BMX tracks. Why? There's more obstacles in the straights today. In the past, BMX was more of a drag race & the jumps were not as big as they're today.


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#15 2012-11-08 8:39am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Interesting, I guess I need to hit the track and see what you mean...I will be doing it on my 80's build though, with front brakes! ;-) Thanks again

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#16 2012-11-08 8:57am

Rastacosta
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

i dont get it either not to mention i think it makes bikes look stupid and is the extra 10" that much weight the low seat looks like a little kids bike that they can barely put their feet on the ground with their crotch hitting the top crossbar of frame


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#17 2012-11-08 9:38am

GhettoBMXstar
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From: Lexington, KY
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Here's a few examples of my home track. This will show how much the bikes and how the racetrack has evolved over 25 years.
The 1986 NBL Grands.:  http://youtu.be/CkB1Q36D1dE    [video]/CkB1Q36D1dE[/video]

2012 USA BMX Bluegrass Nationals.:  http://youtu.be/0NRnjMT-r4k    [video]/0NRnjMT-r4k[/video]

Here's a helmet cam view of Derby BMX.:  http://youtu.be/tofBdwi8nJI       [video]/tofBdwi8nJI[/video]


Burp.

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#18 2012-11-08 9:59am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

That is actually a great comparison! Thanks for posting...

The first 2/3 of the track looks almost the same, then the last straight as those silly whoops where no one pedals...That I do not understand...The last straight at most tracks was always riddled with singles and doubles to see who has the most gas left in the tank!

That made it even more difficuclt for those of us that raced 20, cruiser, and open as we were running back to the gate for the next moto. Often, my open and cruiser were within a few motos and hey would hold the gate for me...

Looks like a great track though, veryold school. Give me backhoe and I'd malke it perfect with a water jump and some triples or quads at the end...Forget that pumping garbage!

Now I wanna go race!!!

Jason

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#19 2012-11-08 10:49am

GhettoBMXstar
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From: Lexington, KY
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Wait till 2013, Derby City is getting all the berms rebuilt & re-paved. Plus. the track is  getting a soil-tech coating to cut down watering and dust. big_smile


Burp.

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#20 2012-11-09 2:12am

FREAKAH
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Try and see how much gas you have left in your tank after pumping a full straight of rhythms, or "whoops" as you call it. Feel the burn!! And it takes full concentration to nail it too!

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#21 2012-11-09 3:07am

tiggy1190
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Give it an honest trial/comparison, and you will see why. I use 24's to commute to work, and have the post up at the Eighties height, and it really hinders me when jumping. I have to have it there, so I don't have to stand the whole 17 miles. Post's on my Flat bike is high for obvious reasons. Personal choice is out of the way if it permits.


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#22 2012-11-09 3:34am

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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

i do remember that pro section at that same facility having a water hole


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#23 2012-11-09 3:46am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Why would you pump a rythum section rather that pedal it? I must imagine it has to do with the shape. I would think a track might want to challenge riders with different shapes...? Thanks

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#24 2012-11-09 5:32am

Therealpoorboy
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

jasonmiami wrote:

Thanks for the reply...However, in my racing days, I remember using the seat for balance or driving the bike to one side or the other on a jump. If the seat is out of the way, I would think I would lose the ability to control the bike?

The wide sloping turn, the seat, helps limit how far you lean the bike over. I find the seat and seat post to me extension of the frame, making it quite useful residence something in the way. Variously backseat posts give you some more room in the cockpit, but slamming it down might make it hit my feet.

Maybe I'm just not getting it and am too old:D

The biggest difference is your clipped in now. No need to have the seat up between your legs to move the bike around as its attached to your feet.  With the asphalt turns now you can lean as far as you want and will rarely wash the front out.

I personally clip in while sitting so I run my post up more than most as im 6'4". Some clip in standing so seat height isnt as important for them.

Old bike/ New bike is a beat argument.  It still boils down to whatever you are most comfortable with.  We have quite a few older guys still using bikes with quill stems and pitbulls and they can beat up on me with my new bikes.


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#25 2012-11-09 6:16am

jasonmiami
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Re: What is with the low seat tilted up on new race bike?

Clip in? As in pedals? What happended to vans and bear traps??? Am I that old?

I only clip in on my road bike, my moutain bikes all have crupis...

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