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What are the main differences between an LTF and a Black Bike frame? When I compare the two from the side and angles, they look near identical. Does the brake bridge mean anything?

nintendoninja · 2012-11-05 11:37am

Ltf has thinner tubing...
Blackbike has euro bb...

papalone13 · 2012-11-05 11:42am

im no expert on geometries, but i thought i remember reading on s&m's website that a dirtbike was essentialy the same thing as a blackbike, but without capped stays. and i think i remember reading that a cam wood 2 had the same geometry as the LTF. id honestly have to look into it but if those were true, than an LTF would be better for street and a black bike would be better for dirt? i own an ltf and the rear end is so short that my heels hit the pegs. greatest street frame ever though.

wds · 2012-11-05 11:45am

I can't remember all the Specs, but the Black Bike had a 74.5 ht angle & the LTF had a 75 ht angle.
-Bill

wds · 2012-11-05 11:49am

Google is your friend.

Black Bike specs:
http://www.albes.com/browseproducts/S-M … FRAME.HTML

LTF Specs:
http://digbmx.mpora.com/dig-this/produc … ltf-frame/

Also, despite the Black Bike specs from Albe's above, I'd say the bulk of the Black Bikes were Euro BB.
-Bill

Last edited by wds (2012-11-05 11:51am)

blueep3piece · 2012-11-05 3:01pm

The black bike started out as a revised PBR frame but with seatstay brake mounts, integrated headset, and a euro bb. Most of them were black, with a couple chrome and white versions. It retained the lower wishbone chainstay design. The original blacks came with black flag type decals with a different mock album cover head tube decal that denotes the frame length. At some point the V1 decals changed to a script type font. V2 black bikes were all flat black, mid bb with smaller dropouts than V1's. The current dirt bikes have taken all the black bike styling and weight saving cues.

The LTF frames had small dropouts, brake mounts that we're shorter and closer to the frame or removable, tapered seat and chainstays, different headtube, tapered seat tube and a tad lighter than the blacks.

Last edited by blueep3piece (2012-11-05 3:03pm)

Roy Munson · 2012-11-05 3:09pm

Ltf and cw2 have completely different geometry and feel. I know because I own both and ride equally.
Same rear end length.
Cw 74.5 71 13.625 11.625
Ltf 75 71 13.625 11.8
Cw is fast low and stable
Ltf is taller twitchy and feels bout the same in speed(minus my shatty ratchet hub)
Same standover height as well.

Black bike feels nothing like either nor does the dirt bike. Dirt bike is black bike. But without the wishbone

Ltf can clear a 33t gear
Cw2 can't clear 30t with perfect chain alignment and the chain slaps the seat stays.

Bb height changes the way a bike rides noticeably.

Last edited by Roy Munson (2012-11-05 3:11pm)

popawoolie · 2012-11-05 4:14pm

I would get a black bike over a ltf

nintendoninja · 2012-11-05 4:35pm

popawoolie wrote:
I would get a black bike over a ltf

+1
Blackbikes can take a beating

wds · 2012-11-05 5:16pm

blueep3piece wrote:
The black bike started out as a revised PBR frame but with seatstay brake mounts, integrated headset, and a euro bb. Most of them were black, with a couple chrome and white versions

One correction, there was one white one. It was a custom order.
Chrome on the other hand was a run of 50 - 100.
-Bill

trailclimber · 2012-11-05 6:02pm

Heres my black bike, with script Decals serial #H5C001

Its nice.

Last edited by trailclimber (2012-11-05 6:03pm)

blueep3piece · 2012-11-06 5:17am

Black Bikes rule. that is all.

Advan · 2012-11-06 5:19am

So, is it sacrilegious to paint a Black Bike red or blue in the S&M community?

I have come to the conclusion for sure that the frame I have, as well as another frame, is a Black Bike.

blueep3piece · 2012-11-06 5:29am

Advan wrote:
So, is it sacrilegious to paint a Black Bike red or blue in the S&M community?

I have come to the conclusion for sure that the frame I have, as well as another frame, is a Black Bike.

what sizes are your black bikes? I'm willing to trade my 20.5" black for a 21" black. mine would be a prime example for a respray and isn't long enough.

I personally wouldn't want any other color, but I have seen a handful and they still look good.

Last edited by blueep3piece (2012-11-06 5:32am)

blueep3piece · 2012-11-06 5:34am

wow I need to get my mind out of the gutter. just read that again and it sounds a little

RDB · 2012-11-06 6:06am

Advan wrote:
So, is it sacrilegious to paint a Black Bike red or blue in the S&M community?

I have come to the conclusion for sure that the frame I have, as well as another frame, is a Black Bike.

you should trade one of those(if one is a 21"TT) for a Solid frame

no, really, you should

Advan · 2012-11-06 6:21am

21" TT is small enough for me. My kid's Black Bike rides perfect, so I am inclined to ride along with him in the bowls.

Last edited by Advan (2012-11-06 6:22am)

Jerry A Hutcher · 2012-11-06 6:30am

I have both as well..Black Bike is a far better bike for sure....The tiki is a LTF also... LTF is a lower stand over hight too..
A look.....
LTF Tiki.

Black Bike.

LTF.

Advan · 2012-11-06 7:41am

Jerry- NICE collection! Looks like you got all of the bases covered!

Jerry A Hutcher wrote:
I have both as well..Black Bike is a far better bike for sure....The tiki is a LTF also... LTF is a lower stand over hight too..
A look.....
LTF Tiki.
http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv25 … a10018.jpg
Black Bike.
http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv25 … 011874.jpg
LTF.
http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv25 … 011907.jpg

Roy Munson · 2012-11-06 8:28am

To say one is better than the other Is ignorant. It's all depends on the style or riding you do and how you want it to feel/ride. Any frame will dent any frame can crack.

RDB · 2012-11-06 8:36am

Roy Munson wrote:
To say one is better than the other Is ignorant. It's all depends on the style or riding you do and how you want it to feel/ride. Any frame will dent any frame can crack.

+1

Jerry A Hutcher · 2012-11-06 9:23am

Roy Munson wrote:
To say one is better than the other Is ignorant. It's all depends on the style or riding you do and how you want it to feel/ride. Any frame will dent any frame can crack.

True...Cause ido love em all....

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S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#2 2012-11-05 11:37am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#3 2012-11-05 11:42am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#4 2012-11-05 11:45am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#5 2012-11-05 11:49am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#6 2012-11-05 3:01pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#7 2012-11-05 3:09pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#8 2012-11-05 4:14pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#9 2012-11-05 4:35pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

popawoolie wrote:

#10 2012-11-05 5:16pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

blueep3piece wrote:

#11 2012-11-05 6:02pm

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#12 2012-11-06 5:17am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#13 2012-11-06 5:19am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#14 2012-11-06 5:29am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

Advan wrote:

#15 2012-11-06 5:34am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#16 2012-11-06 6:06am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

Advan wrote:

#17 2012-11-06 6:21am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#18 2012-11-06 6:30am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#19 2012-11-06 7:41am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

Jerry A Hutcher wrote:

#20 2012-11-06 8:28am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

#21 2012-11-06 8:36am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

Roy Munson wrote:

#22 2012-11-06 9:23am

Re: S&M guys- school me on LTF vs. a Black Bike

Roy Munson wrote:

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